Women Who Wander: Interview #4—Marlo Leaman
From fitness instructor in Illinois to hotelier in the jungles of Costa Rica
🌸I met Marlo in Costa Rica on our residential Yoga Teacher Training program in 2018—weeks spent waking up at the crack of dawn to sweat out our demons on our yoga mats in the jungle, howler monkeys providing the soundtrack. I had never been in the company of just women for that long and and all that estrogen could have spelled disaster, but it turned out to be an uplifting and supportive experience steeped in sisterhood and pura vida. I remember Marlo as having a warm and grounded presence, and I was curious to know more about what it was like for her to build a life abroad. In this interview, she talks about her time running a hotel in Costa Rica and the adventures she has had around the world with her college sweetheart. Hope you enjoy!🌸
Bio
The first half of Marlo’s life took a ‘typical’ path: college, marriage, work, raise two kids in the suburbs. Family travels were common. Her ‘typical’ path veered when her kids were in college and she and her husband sold everything and moved to Costa Rica and bought a small hotel for 5 years. Living abroad has taught her to slow down, be present, accept things as they come. Now living back in the U.S., she is fortunate to spend the second half of life doing things that bring her joy: sleeping in, practicing or teaching yoga, taking dance classes, reading or volunteering at a local food pantry. One thing that brings her the most joy is continuing to travel with her husband of 33 years.
Where are you from and where are you currently based?
I grew up in the suburbs of Chicago, Illinois but I now live in the city of Chicago.
How would you describe your travel style/international experience (e.g., backpacker, digital nomad, luxury, slow travel, expat)?
My current travel style is a combination of active and laid-back. I’m not the ‘sit-at-the-pool all day’ kind of traveler, but I like to get out and explore where I’m visiting. Depending on the country, that could mean exploring markets, churches, or museums or do something more active like hiking or biking. After owning a small hotel in Costa Rica for 5 years, I tend to gravitate to smaller, boutique properties to stay. We were expats in Costa Rica for 5 years.
What are you passionate about outside of travel?
I practice yoga and teach a few classes a week. I love reading, taking dance classes and seeing live music or live theater.
What else would you like people to know about you? (passion projects, work, family, pets, special interests, any other information you feel defines you, etc.)
My husband and I met freshman year in college and have been married almost 33 years! We have two adult kids who live close by, and we’ve been enjoying spending time with them. I volunteer at a food pantry a few times a month which also gives me a chance to practice my Spanish! And I’ve been writing on Substack for about a year and a half and it’s a lot of fun!
When did the travel bug first bite?
As a kid, my family took driving vacations only. My first flight was in the 5th grade, and I didn’t travel internationally until my honeymoon in 1992. I studied Spanish in college and as I learned more about the culture I was really intrigued and wanted to visit Mexico. When I did finally go, I wanted to see more cultures and more of the world.
What inspired you to live abroad?
My husband and I volunteered for a few years with missions to Mexico providing dental care (we aren’t dentists! Ha!) We love Mexico, and its culture and people. We vacationed with our kids to Mexico and then Costa Rica a few times and in Costa Rica fell in love with the country, people and culture. The simpler laid-back, lifestyle was appealing as was the weather, and gorgeous nature. Years ago, we tossed around the idea of living in Costa Rica.
Was there a moment or event that pushed you to live abroad?
Yes, my father dying. After talking about living abroad for years, when my dad died and my kids were both in college, and my husband brought it up again, I couldn’t find a good reason not to. I also know that life is short, and I didn’t want to have any regrets or miss the opportunity. The last lines in one of Mary Oliver’s poems that I love is:
“Doesn’t everything die at last, and too soon? Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?”
So, yeah, why wait?!
What did your friends/family think of your choice to move abroad?
Since we had previously talked about it with our kids, I don’t think they were as surprised about moving abroad as they were about us buying a small hotel! I think they thought we were having a mid-life crisis. Our friends and other family thought we were nuts, and adventurous. I got a lot of people say, “Wow you’re brave, I could never do that.” Weird thing is, I didn’t feel brave at all.
What countries have you lived in/traveled to?
My husband and I lived in Uvita, Costa Rica for a little more than 5 years and we now again live back in the U.S. Other than places in the U.S., I’ve been to Mexico, Canada, Dominican Republic, Chile, South Africa, Botswana, Italy, Germany, France, England, Portugal, Spain, Czech, US Virgin Islands, and Puerto Rico. I’d love to go to Australia.
How do you choose your destinations?
I have a list of countries/places I’d like to see. I created the list either because someone (usually a former hotel guest) told me about it, or I saw/read an article about it. We like to also find places that have unique nature or adventure, something we might not be able to see in the U.S., but I’ve realized every place we go has something unique about it! The world is an amazing place.
What is one thing you never travel without?
My glasses/extra contacts and my tweezers! (I can’t see and god knows when a wayward hair needs to be plucked haha!)
What’s been your most challenging experience abroad?
The whole hotel experience was challenging. After owning the hotel for only six weeks, a hurricane/tropical storm hit that completely destroyed two buildings. To make up for that loss, we ended up closing the hotel, doing a complete remodel and rebuild and reopened. Then a year after reopening, Covid hit and we had to close the hotel for eight months. We were able to reopen and have the last few years be successful before we sold.
What advice would you give to anyone considering opening a hotel abroad?
Don’t do it! Haha! Kidding. I’m not sure if I said, but we had no experience in hotel owning previously. We just knew we’d be bored living abroad and doing ’nothing’. My husband and I always talked about working together and he found the hotel for sale when we were looking to move to Costa Rica so we just went for it! Luckily it already had been in operation and had great people working there who knew what they were doing, so I guess advice for any business abroad is to find good people and especially someone who you trust (luckily we never had a problem with employees stealing or anything like that but know other business owners that did).
How have you dealt with language barriers?
Luckily, Spanish was my college minor, but I had been out of practice. And I learned more verb conjugation and grammar than conversational Spanish. Costa Ricans use some different words than the Mexican/Latin America Spanish I learned in school so really at first there was a lot of pointing and gesturing!
What cultural differences were the hardest to adapt to?
Costa Ricans are laid-back and that’s a good thing. I learned a lot about how to be more laid back from them. They are also very service oriented. We found with owning the hotel and employing locals that sometimes the laid-back attitude carried over to work. We had to set expectations to service more discerning travelers and get things done in a timelier fashion.
I also have become much more laid back and patient after living in Latin America! Have you ever faced discrimination or bias as a solo female traveler or expat?
Costa Rica is a ‘macho’ country and at first our male manager would tend to ask my husband questions and not want to take direction from me, even though I was la jefa! Otherwise, I felt mostly respected there.
What travel or expat mistake taught you the biggest lesson?
Nothing that I can think of specifically except to cross every T and dot every I and get professional help (i.e.: accountants and lawyers) when needed. Don’t chance something to an internet search or another expat’s opinion. Find out laws and rules for yourself, especially being an expat or running a business in a foreign country! I never wanted to do anything wrong for fear of going to foreign jail!
What’s been your most empowering or memorable travel moment?
So many memorable ones! But I think I’d say my most memorable was recently on a safari in Botswana. Early morning on the game drive, we turned the corner to find a beautiful lioness! After stopping the vehicle, and as she walked right next to my side of the car, we locked eyes while she walked by, and I felt a spiritual connection with her. I was not the least bit scared and immediately tears welled in my eyes.
It's my dream to go on safari! Botswana is not a destination I hear much about. Why did you decide to go there versus say, Kenya or South Africa?
We wanted to go to Cape Town and wanted to pick a safari area near/around there. We highly considered Kruger but decided on the Okavango Delta for its interesting landscape and wildlife. My husband had read about Okavango Delta over the years, and it was high on his list. It was everything we could’ve asked for!
Have you ever felt love at first sight with a city/country?
I fell in love with Barcelona on my first visit, Patagonia in Chile and the Okavango Delta in Botswana.
Have you ever participated in a local tradition or ritual that deeply moved you?
In our first months in Costa Rica, we went to celebrate Costa Rican Independence Day at the local community center. It was a beautiful event with school-age children dancing and singing in traditional costumes. We enjoyed traditional food – my first chicharrónes. I felt so proud to be living in Costa Rica.
What’s the most bizarre or unexpected skill you’ve picked up from living abroad?
It’s not a skill, but I’m so much more appreciative of nature and our earth’s resources.
Living in Latin America helped me appreciate La Pachamama so much more too. How has your intuition evolved through travel?
I spend more time experiencing. Being present to the wonders of each place as each place has something to give.
How have your priorities or worldview changed since living abroad?
I’m so glad to have opened my worldview by traveling and living abroad. I think when we travel, we become more compassionate. I think it’s important to travel with respect and curiosity. We as travelers or expats are in someone else’s country, and we need to respect that without imposing ourselves.
Do you feel like the same person who left home?
Nope, not at all.
Tell me more about that. In what ways are you different now?
Sometimes I’m not sure if it’s both life and age experience or living abroad or all three but I’m less uptight, more relaxed, don’t give a shit (anymore) about what others think. I’m less scheduled and although still plan ahead, but if something goes off the rails, it no longer rattles me.
Is there anything you grieve about the life you’ve chosen?
Nope. Certain things were hard to get used to when we first became expats, but I just said that’s how it’s going to be and accepted that.
Have you formed meaningful relationships while abroad—romantic or platonic?
It was hard to make friends at first living abroad. It may have been mostly because we were working a lot and not doing expat-like things. My most meaningful Costa Rican relationship and friend, Karolina, I met at my (our!) yoga teacher training in 2018. Karolina and her husband Brian, expats from Canada, became our close friends and confidants.
That really was a great group of ladies (and Jack ha!)
What’s something you’ve borrowed from another culture that you now consider part of your identity?
Pura vida! To live a simple, peaceful, uncluttered life with deep appreciation for nature, family and friends. That’s the Costa Rican motto!
Ah yes, both the question and answer to everything. I loved the concept of pura vida so much I literally got it tattooed across my heart!
What languages do you speak? Do different sides of your personality come out when you speak different languages?
Spanish I can understand and mostly speak. I like to study common words and travel phrases to places I’m going to visit.
What’s the most hilariously bad translation or miscommunication you’ve experienced?
When talking with our hotel housekeepers, I told them in Spanish that we needed more toallas thinking I was telling them that we needed more bath towels. But in Costa Rica, toalla is mostly used to mean feminine napkin!
What does home mean to you?
A place where you are most comfortable being yourself.
What reverse culture shock have you experienced returning to your home country?
The overabundance of things and the accessibility of anything, anywhere at any time!
That seems to be a big one for U.S. citizens. Myself included!
If your travel life had a theme song, what would it be?
Eek! Picking a song is like choosing a favorite child—it’s not possible! Songs for me come at exact moments when you need them to speak to you. If I had to pick one, it’s my favorite song, Somewhere Over the Rainbow from the Wizard of Oz. It’s been such a dreamy visual for me, full of possibilities, why then, oh why not I?!
There’s a land that I heard of once in a lullaby
Somewhere over the rainbow skies are blue
And the dreams that you dare to dream really do come true
Someday I’ll wish upon a star
And wake up where the clouds are far
Behind me
That’s where you’ll find me
Somewhere over the rainbow, bluebirds fly
Birds fly over the rainbow
Why then, oh, why can’t I?
If you want to follow Marlo on her adventures, and read more about her time in Costa Rica, check out her Substack:
Great interview. Awesome that yoga teacher training created lasting connections. Thank you for the insights!
Lol at the "Don't do it!" advice 😁 Great interview, Marlo. Following your journey has been so fun!